William James

14

Dene James on 10th July 2019

Much misinformation in the above accounts. William Baptised 5 February 1792 at St Mary's Hanley Castle. No child named Jane born to this family. Their youngest child was born about September 1835 and died November 1835. Only record of the child state the 'The infant at the breast when Mrs JAmes Hanged herself has since died. No mention of sex or age. Source affidavit by William James given to Sir John Jamieson from Darlinghurst gaol. Jane James was born 1833 to Thomas James and his wife Ann. She died in 1835. Jane Smith was working for Mary and William before Mary's death. William married Jane 26th May 1839 at St John's Parramatta. A lot of the evidence in William's trial was untrue andgiven to cover the tracks of those involved in the family's story. Phil Hands appears to just having copied verbatim from the Newspapers. These wwere just as unreliable then as they are today

174

Iris Dunne on 6th June 2019

Convict Indents: aged 27, Convicted 12 March 1817 in Stafford, Trade: Labourer Sydney Gaol Description Book: Year of Birth 1795, Year 1835

14

Dene James on 6th June 2019

On Mary's second attempt to hang herself, she had locked herself into a separate room so the assertion that William assisted her by pulling her legs was a fabrication. When her son was able to enter the room he was the one who cut her down. Letters of the day that I have in my possession state that they were in their own Inn and that it was a well run place and that Mary and William were good hosts and it was very quiet and well run. Thomas Michael Pembroke was losing business to Mary and William, hence the trouble that he was causing them. So much misinformation attributed to this family by Thomas Pembroke and the Collits family in order to keep their own names clean. William and Mary have been treated harshly by history.

14

Dene James on 6th June 2019

Many errors in the court errors. The child who was just a babe when Mary hanged herself is only ever identified in an affidavit by William re the births and birthplaces of the children. ' The infant at the breast when Mrs James hanged herself has since died. Affidavit to Sir John Jamieson Nov 1835.The child Jane who died in 1835 was the child of Joseph and Anne Registrations number 1777/1835 V28351588 19.Jane was born in 18336/1833 V18336 18.

14

Dene James on 6th June 2019

William was originally sentenced to death for Horse stealing. His sentence was commuted to 7 years transportation. (Court records) A lot more information re William's wife. No evidence that she was a habitual drunkard. The family were being harassed who wanted the land on which William had settled and kept reporting him to the authorities at Penrith. Mary had a young baby and was possibly suffering from what nowadays is known as post natal depression. Documents and letters of the day. Newspaper accounts of the time have many errors in them re this family.

5

Dene James on 4th February 2018

Errors in Phil Hands Story re William James and Mary Hopkins. This couple did NOT have a daughter named Jane.. Their children were John 1821, Isaac 1825, Caroline 1827 Maria, 1829, Simon Jacob 1830 and an unnamed infant born and died in 1835. Jane was born to Joseph and Anne in 1833. No evidence as to Mary being a habitual drunkard except the newspapers of the day. Letters in my possession re this family give no evidence of this fact.

5

Dene James on 4th February 2018

There are 2 deaths either of which would fit William James 184 or 1851 in the Mudgee district. On consultation with both the churches and the Archives office either one could fit him as his movements after his release are unconfirmed.

54

Phil Hands on 7th March 2017

Married Mary Hopkins (daughter of convicts John Hopkins, 'Matilda' 1791 & Hannah Birmingham, 'Marquis Cornwallis' 1796) in 1820 at St John's Church Parramatta. Mary was a habitual drunk, perhaps she was unable to cope with the birth of her newborn daughter Jane, decided that it was time to end her life down at 20 Mile Hollow, Woodford at 8am in the morning. It may have been post natal depression and the stress of the continual flow of travelers together with the drunken encounters of the two squabbling neighbors over the land - Thomas Pembroke and her husband were always at each other over the rights to the land. Pembroke was ordered to pay William James for the land that he was squatting on and had applied for a grant. However Pembroke started the trouble with the courts, but no payment was ever received by William James or his family. Mary's death was recorded as being 12th October 1835 at 20 Mile Hollow, Woodford, NSW (by own hand). Mary had been born on the 30th January 1797 at Parramatta. She was aged 32 when she took her own life and hung herself from the rafters. While Thomas Pembroke was the licensee of the Inn, Mary James was discovered hanging in the room and her husband was charged with her murder. The case against him was subsequently dismissed and after a second trial he was freed. Thomas was a material witness for the Crown but was too inebriated to finish giving evidence. He was placed in gaol on February 3 to dry out and the case adjourned until 8th December 1836 when James was found guilty, but later pardoned for reasons of fairness in regard to the Judge's wrongful discharge of the Jury in the first instance. The Australian Tuesday 16th August 1836 p. 2. Before Mr Justice Kinchela and a Military Jury. William James, a free man, residing at Twenty-mile Hollow, in the district of Bathurst, was indicted for the wilful murder of Mary his wife, by strangling her with a handkerchief, on the 12th October last. Guilty - death. Respited until the opinion of the Judges could be taken on a point of law raised in his favour by his Counsel. Sydney Gazette Tuesday 16th August 1836 p. 3 William James stood indicted for the wilful murder of Mary his wife, by strangling her on the 29th January last, at Twenty-Mile Hollow, in the neighbourhood of Bathurst. It appeared from the evidence, that prisoner and deceased lived very unhappily together. The latter had formed a design to hang herself, and "tucked" herself up with a pocket handkerchief, but being perceived by a neighbour was cut down ere life was extinct. When she came round to her senses, she expressed her anger at her kindly neighbour having served her such "a turn" for had she been let alone she would then have been in a better world, and added she was determined to put an end to her existence. The husband who was then present, said she was not "game enough" to do it. She upon being taunted, tyed herself up again with her handkerchief, and standing upon a box kicked it away. Whilst she was thus suspended, the husband pulled her by the legs, and death necessarily ensued. The jury not being able to agree were locked up for the night. Sydney Herald Monday 15th August 1836 p. 2 Before Justice Kinchela and a Military Jury. William James, a free man, residing at Twenty-mile Hollow, in the district of Bathurst, was indicted for the wilful murder of Mary his wife, by strangling her with a handkerchief on the 12th October last. When the jury had been sworn, Mr Foster requested his Honor to take a note of his objection to the competency of the Court to try this prisoner, he having been formerly tried, when through the drunkenness of a witness the jury had been discharged without giving a verdict. The Judge said that the proper method would have been for the prisoner to have pleaded his former trial, he would however reserve the point. The Attorney-General briefly stated the case to the Jury. The prisoner's wife had threatened to hang herself, and had tied a handkerchief to a rafter for that purpose, when the prisoner not only put it round her neck, but shoved her of the box. If he proved these facts the Judge would tell them it was murder. The prisoner had been arraigned last session, but a witness being drunk Mr Justice Burton discharged the jury. Now He (the Attorney-General) was not very clear whether a Judge had power to discharge a jury; at any rate he should like to have the decision of a full Court. In the present case if the jury acquitted the prisoner on the facts, of course the point of law would be gone; if they found him guilty he would have the benefit of it. The following witnesses were then called: Patrick Cahan, private in the 4th Regiment being sworn, stated, on the 12th October last, I was in company with Corporal Spence at the prisoner's house, at Twenty-mile Hollow; we called in to light our pipes in the afternoon; we remained but a very short time, we saw the prisoner and some children; three or four minutes afterwards a female named Smith called me in to see Mrs James; I looked between the slabs and saw her hanging by a black handkerchief from the rafters; there was a box near her feet, she appeared to be dead; her hands were up as if she had been trying to lay hold of the handkerchief; I called out to Corporal Spence and told him; the prisoner was in the kitchen, and he came to me when I called out, and said "go and cut her down". I told him to go himself, and I saw the prisoner's son go into the room with a knife to cut her down and I think the prisoner helped him; a publican named Pembroke, who resided near the spot, came up, and him, me, and the Corporal, went into the room, the deceased was lying on the floor, and Mr. Pembroke said he was sure she was dead; the prisoner was sober, he appeared to be melancholy. Cross-examined - When we first went in we saw the prisoner near the fire; not more than five minutes had elapsed when Jane Smith called me; I went in immediately, James was still in the kitchen; I cannot say whether the door was locked inside; Corporal Spence went to Pembroke's; I did not hear the deceased when we first went in; if she had made any alarm I must have heard it; Creran did not give me the alarm. It was Jane Smith; I saw Creran in the house after Mr Pembroke had arrived, some time had then elapsed; I saw him come out of another room; there was no time for the prisoner to have hung his wife from the first time I entered until I gave the alarm; no person without peering could see Mrs James hanging. Re-examined - Creran might have got into the house by another door; I do not know whether he was in the house before; I was asking Creran some questions, but he told me I was no magistrate. By a Juror - Creran said he knew all about it. Patrick Creran - I have been free three years; I have been ten years in the colony; I was at Pembroke's the day Mrs James was hanged; one of her sons came crying out that his mother was hanging; it was about eight or nine o'clock in the day; I went up to the house; I saw James, and asked him what was the matter; he said there was nothing the matter and asked me what business I had there; the children were all laughing at the door; I went into the room and saw the woman hanging; I cut her down; James was standing with his back to the fire; he threatened me and said I had no right to interfere; there was a dispute between me and James; I got him fined 40 shillings, he did not like to see me about the house; I heard James say "let her hang and be d____d;" this was before I cut her down; she was hanging by a red handkerchief; when I cut her down she was a long time before she came to; when she did come to she took some rum that James had, but he gave her a push and she fell down; I had seen Mrs James before that morning; while I was trying to recover Mrs James, the prisoner was in the kitchen, he gave me no assistance when Mrs James came into the kitchen she said she understood I was the b----y rogue that cut her down; she was angry with me; I said I did cut her down, and I asked her if she was not glad of it; she replied no, the prisoner had been long enough trying it on, and that if I had not interfered she would have been in a better world. The prisoner and his wife then had a dispute about Jane Smith, and I went into another room, and by standing on the sofa I was able to see into the room in which the prisoner and his wife usually slept; I saw Mrs James with a black handkerchief in her hand which she tied to a rafter; she asked the prisoner, who was in the next room, where her eldest son was, and he said he had gone for sugar; Mrs James then got on a box, and the prisoner came to the room door and asked her if she was as game as she pretended; she said she wanted to see her eldest son; the prisoner said stop a minute, and then put the handkerchief round her neck and pushed her off the box; he then dragged her by the feet; he then left her and went into the kitchen; the son almost immediately came in and cut her down; the sudden jerk he gave her must have hung her; I saw the soldiers come in; I heard the soldiers sing out; I was on the sofa and was looking over the wall when I saw the prisoner drag his wife by the feet; I intended to have cut her down, but the son was before me; the boy entered the room almost immediately after the prisoner left it. Cross-examined - I was drinking at Pembroke's when the son came to me; I was at the door and saw the boy; I got there in time to save her; I was in the house the second time but not in time then; it was after the soldiers had come in to light their pipes that James acted as I have described; I do not know whether the door was locked inside; I did not tell constable Abrahams that the door was locked; I should have made an alarm if I had not been afraid the prisoner would have escaped' if I had done such a deed I should have run away; I knew he had pistols in the house; and I told the magistrates at Penrith that was the reason; the prisoner had threatened to take my life; I thought it was necessary to keep my eye on him; there was no time lsot before the soldiers made an alarm; I did at one time say I saw the deceased through the slabs, but it was the first time I alluded to; I do not think I said so with regard to the second time; the box was about half a yard high; it might have been more or less; I did not hear Jane Smith call the soldiers' I did not see the soldier from the time he lot his pipe until Mr Pembroke was in the house; I did not see him look through the door; when I saw the prisoner leave the room; I got down as gently as I could in order that the prisoner might not hear me for fear he should blow my brains out, and I got out of the room as quick as possible but the son was before me. Cahan recalled, I never left the house from the time Smith called me until Pembroke came up; if Creran had been trying to cut the woman down I must have seen him. Cross examination of Creran continued. I laid two informations against James, I convicted him on one of them; I was charged with perjury but it could not be proved; I was in the house about settling one of the informations, the prisoner sent for me and offered me a pound and a pistol; I have just been giving evidence in the other Court; I swore that all my clothes were stripped off me, and the man who was with me swore I was not stripped, but it is easy to get people to swear any thing; James was partly drunk; I was not out of the house from the time she was hanging the first time until the second time; I remained in the room all that time through what I heard amongst them; I wanted to see whether she was for hanging herself, or he was for hanging her; I saw that officer (Mr Faunce) come in. Mr Pembroke an inn keeper residing at Twenty-mile Hollow. Corporal Spence called me and said Mrs James was hanging; I went up to the house; the body was cut down; I recommended James to send to the depot for a medical man, but he refused; the body was quite dead; I saw Creran at the house. Cross-examined - The prisoner refused to send for medical attention; he afterwards appeared to be in great tribulation; the deceased was subject to take a drop' Creran called me on one side and pointed out a place from where he said he saw the prisoner commit the act; I did not know anything about the deceased having attempted to hang herself before; I do not think Creran was at my house that morning; I understood Creran to say he had seen through the slabs; he did not tell me that he had got on the sofa and looked over the wall; I cannot say whether he could have done so; no person came to my house and called Creran to go and cut the woman down. Mr Thomas Black - Surgeon - On examining the body of the deceased, I found one or two slight contusions on the eye, but think they were inflicted by her falling forward after she had been cut down; she died by strangulation, which I have no doubt was caused by hanging. Cross-examined - Creran said he saw the transaction through the slabs; he never said anything about sofa or bark; he said her feet were about the height of the table from the ground, but that was impossible, as from the position of the handkerchief, her feet could only just be clear of the ground; I recollect Creran was flogger at the station; from the very inconsistent manner in which he gave his evidence I would not believe him on hos oath. The prisoner made no defence, but called the following witnessed:- District Constable Samuel - I was sent to the Twenty-mile Hollow; Creran told me the door was bolted inside; he took me into the inside room and shewed me where he said he stood to see James put the handkerchief over his wife's head; I am a taller man than Creran, but when I got on the sofa, I could not see over; I could not lift the bark, I was not high enough. Lieitenant Faunce, 4th Regiment - I was on the spot with Mr Campbell the magistrate just after the affair; Creran did not offer his evidence; after all the persons had been examined. Mr Campbell said as Creran was a constable he would examine him, and then he told this long story; I would not believe him on his oath; the box pointed out as the one from which the deceased was thrown, was about seven inches high. Mr Foster said that he had other witnesses, but he did not think it was necessary to call them. Mr Justice Kinchela said, that in law, a person who assisted another to commit suicide, was guilty of murder; so that in a case where two disappointed lovers agreed to commit suicide, and went out in a boat for the purpose of drowning themselves, and one of them survived, the survivor was held to be guilty of murder, and the case was afterward argued before the twelve judges, who were of the same opinion. The present case as it affected the prisoner, stood solely on the evidence of Creran; they had heard his evidence, and they had heard what had been said about him, and it was for them to shew by their verdict whether they believed him. When the jury had been absent for half an hour, they returned, and the Foreman (Captain Macpherson) said that they wished to examien James the son of the prisoner, who cut his mother down. Mr Justice Kinchela said that they were bound to return a verdict on the evidence laid before them; they could re-examine any witness they pleased, but they could call no new ones; neither the prosecutor nor the defendant had called him; and the Jury could not. Captain M said that there was no likelihood of their agreeing, and they again left the Court which was adjourned for two hours. Soon after seven o'clock the Jury again returned to Court, and said they were unable to agree upon which his Honor said that he was very sorry, but he must lock them up for the night. He could not discharge them without the consent of the Crown and the prisoner. If the Crown would forego the prosecution entirely, or the prisoner consent to be tried again, a Juror could be withdrawn, otherwise they were entitled to a verdict. Mr Cater on the part of the Attorney-General and Mr Foster on the part of the prisoner refused to accede to the suggestion, and the Jury were locked up for the night. Saturday August 13th. Upon Mr Justice Kinchela taking his seat this morning, the jury in the James' case, who had been locked up all night, came into Court and returned a verdict of Guilty. Death. Ordered for execution on Monday morning. His Honor stated that he would respite the prisoner until he could take the opinion of the Judges on the point raised in his behalf by Mr Foster. Citation details: Sydney Gazette Saturday 21st October 1837 p. 2 William James, tried on the 13th August, 1836, and Alexander Lambert tried on the 5th November 1836, both under sentence of death, the former for the murder of his wife, and the latter for a murder committed at Bathurst, but who were respited, and have since been lying at the Phoenix Hulk, were yesterday removed to the gaol to await His Excellency's pleasure.