Thomas Lorman

7

Helen Pinner on 28th October 2019

This convict you have here is not the convict who married Mary Butcher. Mary Butcher married Thomas Loman alias Benbow alias Jones. He was tried under the name Thomas Jones in Middlesex. Arrived in Australia in 1829. Sorry but two different Thomas Loman’s

105

Denis Pember on 3rd March 2016

In the colony, Thomas married the much younger Mary Butcher. They married in about 1843, he must have been about 43 years old, Mary was 18. Mary was the daughter of Philip Butcher (Convict, Surrey, 1814) and Mary Jacob (Convict, Elizabeth , 1818). Thomas and Mary had 7 children

105

Denis Pember on 3rd March 2016

Old Bailey Transcripts. t18131201-14 http://www.oldbaileyonline.org/browse.jsp?id=t18131201-14 GEORGE CHAMBERS and THOMAS LORMAN were indicted for burglariously breaking and entering the dwelling-house of Thomas Bland , about the hour of nine on the night of the 10th of November , and stealing therein a great coat, value 10 s. a hat, value 5 s. and a pair of gloves, value 6 d. the property of Thomas Moxon ; and a great coat, value 10 s. the property of John Moxon . THOMAS MOXON . On the 10th of November last I went with a friend to dine at the Bath hotel in Harlington-street, Piccadilly . When I got there it was about five o'clock in the afternoon; I pulled off my great coat, and put it on a chair in the hall. I left my hat and my brother's hat and coat on the chair. About ten o'clock in the evening the waiter came in and asked us whether we had come with hats and great coats and gloves. I went to the place in the hall where I had left them; they were gone. The officer came in about ten minutes after the waiter; he had got my great coat and hat, and my brother's great coat. I remarked at the time that I had a pair of gloves in my pocket; he went and fetched them. EDWARD BLAND . I live at the Bath hotel, in Harlington-street. My father's name is Thomas Bland ; the hotel is kept by him . It is in the parish of St. George; Hanover-square. I was in the hotel at the time this transaction happened. Q. Do you know the hall or passage going into hotel - A. Yes, towards the street. It is the entrance into the hotel part; it is opened by a glass door with a pulley; that is the regular entrance into the hotel part. I remember Mr. Moxon being there, and near ten o'clock I missed the coats and hats off the chairs. I had seen them on the chairs. I went into the room, and asked the gentlemen if they had missed them; they said, no. I recollected in the course of the evening seeing two persons coming and making some enquiries, but whether they were the prisoners I cannot say. That was about nine o'clock; it was dark then. While we were enquiring, Nicolls the officer and some others came in with the coats and the prisoners. The prisoners were taken to the watchhouse. WILLIAM NICOLLS . I am an officer. I was the person that brought the great coats into the Bath hotel. On the 10th of November I was upon duty that evening; I was at the Gloucester coffee-house, seeing the mails off, as we generally do of a night. We attend regular from eight o'clock to a quarter past eight. The two prisoners passed the Gloucester coffee-house. I am sure of their persons; I knew them well; that induced me to follow them: they crossed over to Harlington-street to the door of the Bath hotel; they walked by the door several times; they entered the avenue; that is the covered way of the street door, before you come to the glass door; they then went round to the other door in Piccadilly, they went into the passage there; that is an openpassage; they returned back into Harlington-street, and at that door they watched there for some time in and out of that avenue, until there was an opportunity. I saw one of the prisoners push the door open, and go in, and the other held the door until he came out. They both then came away together, as close as if they were arm in arm together. I followed them down Harlington-street; I had placed Payntington and Jones at the corner of Harlington-street, to prevent their escape. When I got near to to them I called out to Payntington and Jones; I then saw something drop from one of the prisoners. I cannot say which of them, nor could I tell what it was until I came to it. When they came out I perceived a bulk in one of their arms; which of them had it I cannot swear. It dropped from one or other of them. Q. You saw something drop from the prisoners - A. Yes. Q. You could not swear what it was - A. Not till I came to it. I saw the hat roll into the kennel; Payntington and Jones turned round the corner, and took the two prisoners into custody immediately; this was all in my sight. Q. Are you sure the two men Payntington and Jones took, are the same men that you saw come from the door of the Bath hotel - A. Yes. I picked up the coats and the hat. THOMAS PAYNTINGTON . I was upon duty with Nicolls. I observed no further than what he has stated. When Nicolls called out, I stopped Lorman; Jones stopped Chambers. I searched Lorman; I found only a knife upon him. THOMAS JONES . I was with Nicolls and Payntington. I saw them coming along. I knew Chambers very well. I laid hold of Chambers; Payntington laid hold of the other. I found the gloves afterwards in the necessary, after they were locked up in the watchhouse, under the seat; they were throwed down. I gave the gloves to Nicolls. ABRAHAM FARROW . I was with Nicolls, Jones, and Payington. I saw the two prisoners pass by the Gloucester coffee-house; I saw the prisoners go to the Bath hotel; I saw them come out of the Bath hotel; I saw them drop something; I could not exactly tell what it was. Q. Could you see sufficient so as to be sure that one of the men that dropped something was one of the men that came from the hotel - A. I did. I am sure I found in Chambers's pocket a pair of gloves. I observed a button at the wrist of the gloves. The next morning I saw the gloves that Jones found in the necessary; they were the same gloves. Chambers asked me for the gloves and handkerchief I found in his pocket. I gave them him; I thought they were his own. The next morning I saw them again, when Jones found them in the necessary; they are the same gloves I found in Chambers's pocket. Q. to Prosecutor. Just look at these things - A. This is my great coat, and the hat I can swear to by the shape and look, and the gloves are mine; they have buttons at the wrist, and I know the other great coat; it is my brother's. CHAMBERS, GUILTY , aged 36. LORMAN, GUILTY , aged 31. Of stealing only, but not of breaking and entering the dwelling-house. Transported for Seven Years . Second Middlesex jury, before Mr. Justice Le Blanc.